Comments on: The Importance of Not Being Too Earnest http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/ A mutual support group for SF/F Novelists Thu, 11 Mar 2010 15:13:25 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.1 By: David B. Coe http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7326 David B. Coe Tue, 20 Oct 2009 19:17:52 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7326 Interesting post and discussion. I like well-rounded characters. I like villains who are complex and understandable enough to be sympathetic in a way, or at least understandable. But in the end, I like to kill my villains, and I like my readers to feel that the killing was a good thing. Interesting post and discussion. I like well-rounded characters. I like villains who are complex and understandable enough to be sympathetic in a way, or at least understandable. But in the end, I like to kill my villains, and I like my readers to feel that the killing was a good thing.

]]> By: Elias McClellan http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7320 Elias McClellan Tue, 20 Oct 2009 12:43:20 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7320 I disagree with the 'cartoon vision,' Mr. Butler. As I read the news on any number of hot-button issues, it seems that once you strip away the prepared arguments, it all comes down to 'I want what I want and I don't care about anything else.' What I appreciate in a thief is the honesty. What I can sympathize with in a dictator, like Mao is the initial drive to correct a wrong. What I have no patience for is the hypocrite who dresses his/her (Reagan/Thatcher) dirty-deeds as virtue. I disagree with the ‘cartoon vision,’ Mr. Butler. As I read the news on any number of hot-button issues, it seems that once you strip away the prepared arguments, it all comes down to ‘I want what I want and I don’t care about anything else.’

What I appreciate in a thief is the honesty. What I can sympathize with in a dictator, like Mao is the initial drive to correct a wrong. What I have no patience for is the hypocrite who dresses his/her (Reagan/Thatcher) dirty-deeds as virtue.

]]> By: S.C. Butler http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7319 S.C. Butler Tue, 20 Oct 2009 12:26:54 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7319 Dave - Glad you enjoyed the panel. My own philosophy for portraying evil is to have the baddie plain not care about whether or not what he wants is going to hurt other people. Which probably comes closer to the cartoon vision. Dave - Glad you enjoyed the panel. My own philosophy for portraying evil is to have the baddie plain not care about whether or not what he wants is going to hurt other people. Which probably comes closer to the cartoon vision.

]]> By: NewGuyDave http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7310 NewGuyDave Tue, 20 Oct 2009 01:29:05 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7310 Great post. I like gray areas, but I also enjoy a definitive good vs evil in fantasy. I made my MC, Drohan main protagonist a vengeful murderer, but trying to change. My antagonist used to be a rule-the-world villain, but now he's doing what he sees as just, but the ramifications would be disastrous. And he's not afraid to shed a little blood along the way. Clearly evil for the story, but doesn't think of himself as such, or come across as uber-cartoony eeeevil. Hopefully the lines aren't blurred too much. BTW, the Evil Panel was great. Glad I could listen in and ask questions. Cheers, NGD Great post. I like gray areas, but I also enjoy a definitive good vs evil in fantasy.

I made my MC, Drohan main protagonist a vengeful murderer, but trying to change. My antagonist used to be a rule-the-world villain, but now he’s doing what he sees as just, but the ramifications would be disastrous. And he’s not afraid to shed a little blood along the way. Clearly evil for the story, but doesn’t think of himself as such, or come across as uber-cartoony eeeevil. Hopefully the lines aren’t blurred too much.

BTW, the Evil Panel was great. Glad I could listen in and ask questions.

Cheers,
NGD

]]> By: S.C. Butler http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7305 S.C. Butler Mon, 19 Oct 2009 15:09:24 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7305 Elias - If you don't think you're grown up enough to read it, cances are you aren't. Elias - If you don’t think you’re grown up enough to read it, cances are you aren’t.

]]> By: Elias McClellan http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7296 Elias McClellan Mon, 19 Oct 2009 01:44:07 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7296 Mr. Butler, again, you give me something to look up. By the way, I bought 'Perfume.' I don't know that I'm grown enough to read it but I think that goes to Marie Brennan's, 'Age-appropriate' post. Mr. Butler, again, you give me something to look up. By the way, I bought ‘Perfume.’ I don’t know that I’m grown enough to read it but I think that goes to Marie Brennan’s, ‘Age-appropriate’ post.

]]> By: S.C. Butler http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7295 S.C. Butler Mon, 19 Oct 2009 01:13:31 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7295 Elias - I'm a firm believer in greasing vamps. Love that Buffy vs Edward video. Elias - I’m a firm believer in greasing vamps. Love that Buffy vs Edward video.

]]> By: Elias McClellan http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7259 Elias McClellan Fri, 16 Oct 2009 22:00:16 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7259 Adendum, I meant to say I didn't articulate my intent well in regards to hero/villian roles in books. I'm far more interested in the thief than the cop or the Sith than the Jedi. But moral ambiguity aside, I'd grease a vampire in a second. Then again, who over the age of 16 wouldn't? Adendum, I meant to say I didn’t articulate my intent well in regards to hero/villian roles in books. I’m far more interested in the thief than the cop or the Sith than the Jedi. But moral ambiguity aside, I’d grease a vampire in a second. Then again, who over the age of 16 wouldn’t?

]]> By: Elias McClellan http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7258 Elias McClellan Fri, 16 Oct 2009 21:55:58 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7258 Mr. Butler, thanks for the tip. I haven't read Perfume but I'll google for a synopsis and eval for my to-read list. My interest comes from most things writen by Elmore Leonard, a lot by Walter Mosley, and everything by Donald Westlake, RIP. Mr. Butler, thanks for the tip. I haven’t read Perfume but I’ll google for a synopsis and eval for my to-read list. My interest comes from most things writen by Elmore Leonard, a lot by Walter Mosley, and everything by Donald Westlake, RIP.

]]> By: S.C. Butler http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7257 S.C. Butler Fri, 16 Oct 2009 21:52:02 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/10/15/the-importance-of-not-being-too-earnest/#comment-7257 Elias - Have you ever read Perfume? The villain can be the protagonist, but never the hero. Elias - Have you ever read Perfume? The villain can be the protagonist, but never the hero.

]]>