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	<title>Comments on: How I write female characters</title>
	<link>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/</link>
	<description>A mutual support group for SF/F Novelists</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 21 Mar 2010 23:09:56 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: The value of the Bechdel Test at SF Novelists</title>
		<link>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-7046</link>
		<author>The value of the Bechdel Test at SF Novelists</author>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Sep 2009 10:01:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-7046</guid>
		<description>[...] never talk about men; it&#8217;s that they should have other things they talk about too. (Remember, women are people.) Too many female characters in this kind of story are defined by their relationships to men: [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] never talk about men; it&#8217;s that they should have other things they talk about too. (Remember, women are people.) Too many female characters in this kind of story are defined by their relationships to men: [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: A matter of leverage at SF Novelists</title>
		<link>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6603</link>
		<author>A matter of leverage at SF Novelists</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 10:01:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6603</guid>
		<description>[...] been thinking a lot about characterization lately. Partly this is because the protagonist of my current work in [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] been thinking a lot about characterization lately. Partly this is because the protagonist of my current work in [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Writing women (links) &#124; Let's Fold Scarves</title>
		<link>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6518</link>
		<author>Writing women (links) &#124; Let's Fold Scarves</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Jun 2009 22:52:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6518</guid>
		<description>[...] some great stuff from Marie Brennan, We’re people. We’re individuals. We’re not Women, and we’re not types, either — the Cold [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] some great stuff from Marie Brennan, We’re people. We’re individuals. We’re not Women, and we’re not types, either — the Cold [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Jennifer</title>
		<link>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6433</link>
		<author>Jennifer</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 May 2009 21:47:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6433</guid>
		<description>You know what I've always wanted to say about this topic? 

"I think of a woman, and then I take away reason and accountability."

Heh, but seriously now, people are people. Just that some have some different concerns than other ones.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know what I&#8217;ve always wanted to say about this topic? </p>
<p>&#8220;I think of a woman, and then I take away reason and accountability.&#8221;</p>
<p>Heh, but seriously now, people are people. Just that some have some different concerns than other ones.</p>
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		<title>By: Marie Brennan</title>
		<link>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6427</link>
		<author>Marie Brennan</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 May 2009 23:38:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6427</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;But again, when I came to approach that section I immediately realised, while typing, that I didn’t need to address it at all - because her character as I’d established it was such that she wouldn’t dwell on it, and certainly wouldn’t write about it.&lt;/i&gt;

Wellllll, that one's complicated.  First of all, the way rape gets used for female characters is really problematic -- this is off-topic, so I won't go into detail here, but it starts with the fact that male characters can have all kinds of trauma, but women in fiction are extremely likely (relatively speaking) to be rape victims.

More to the point of characterization -- even if she doesn't dwell on it or talk about it, that experience will still shape her behavior in lots of unspoken ways.  If it doesn't, then that's one of the other problems with rape in fiction, which is that the consequences don't get represented accurately.

I haven't read the story, obviously, so I have no idea how you handled it.  But if I can temporarily interrupt my own thread for a PSA: if you're going to put that trope into a story, please please *please* do your research.  Talk to rape counselors, find out how different kinds of people react, make sure you do justice to the crime (as it were).

(Sorry if that came off as lecturing, Scott -- I don't mean it to be.  More taking the chance to say these things so anybody else reading the thread can think about them.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>But again, when I came to approach that section I immediately realised, while typing, that I didn’t need to address it at all - because her character as I’d established it was such that she wouldn’t dwell on it, and certainly wouldn’t write about it.</i></p>
<p>Wellllll, that one&#8217;s complicated.  First of all, the way rape gets used for female characters is really problematic &#8212; this is off-topic, so I won&#8217;t go into detail here, but it starts with the fact that male characters can have all kinds of trauma, but women in fiction are extremely likely (relatively speaking) to be rape victims.</p>
<p>More to the point of characterization &#8212; even if she doesn&#8217;t dwell on it or talk about it, that experience will still shape her behavior in lots of unspoken ways.  If it doesn&#8217;t, then that&#8217;s one of the other problems with rape in fiction, which is that the consequences don&#8217;t get represented accurately.</p>
<p>I haven&#8217;t read the story, obviously, so I have no idea how you handled it.  But if I can temporarily interrupt my own thread for a PSA: if you&#8217;re going to put that trope into a story, please please *please* do your research.  Talk to rape counselors, find out how different kinds of people react, make sure you do justice to the crime (as it were).</p>
<p>(Sorry if that came off as lecturing, Scott &#8212; I don&#8217;t mean it to be.  More taking the chance to say these things so anybody else reading the thread can think about them.)</p>
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		<title>By: Scott Andrews</title>
		<link>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6412</link>
		<author>Scott Andrews</author>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 May 2009 14:45:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6412</guid>
		<description>Fabulous post, and I agree 100%. My second novel is half narrated by a female character and I was a bit wary at first, unsure if I could pull it off. But the moment I sat down to write in her voice I found that there was nothing to worry about. She was a person who had her own fears, backstory, objectives and so forth, but when it came to writing her chapters the only major difference I found was the way the male characters reacted to her.

The only area I shied away from was writing her reactions to a rape she suffered in a previous book. I agonised about how to approach it. I felt that anything I tried to write would feel false and glib. But again, when I came to approach that section I immediately realised, while typing, that I didn't need to address it at all - because her character as I'd established it was such that she wouldn't dwell on it, and certainly wouldn't write about it. So I'd unwittingly let myself off the hook, kind off.

But that aside, it seems to me that person first, role second, gender third is exactly the way to approach writing a character of opposite gender to yourself, be you male or female.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fabulous post, and I agree 100%. My second novel is half narrated by a female character and I was a bit wary at first, unsure if I could pull it off. But the moment I sat down to write in her voice I found that there was nothing to worry about. She was a person who had her own fears, backstory, objectives and so forth, but when it came to writing her chapters the only major difference I found was the way the male characters reacted to her.</p>
<p>The only area I shied away from was writing her reactions to a rape she suffered in a previous book. I agonised about how to approach it. I felt that anything I tried to write would feel false and glib. But again, when I came to approach that section I immediately realised, while typing, that I didn&#8217;t need to address it at all - because her character as I&#8217;d established it was such that she wouldn&#8217;t dwell on it, and certainly wouldn&#8217;t write about it. So I&#8217;d unwittingly let myself off the hook, kind off.</p>
<p>But that aside, it seems to me that person first, role second, gender third is exactly the way to approach writing a character of opposite gender to yourself, be you male or female.</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Green</title>
		<link>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6407</link>
		<author>Jonathan Green</author>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 May 2009 09:25:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6407</guid>
		<description>What a great post, Marie. And what a relief. 

I've just finished a novella with a femal protagonist and didn't actively set out to write 'a woman'. I hope, instead, to have created an interesting character.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What a great post, Marie. And what a relief. </p>
<p>I&#8217;ve just finished a novella with a femal protagonist and didn&#8217;t actively set out to write &#8216;a woman&#8217;. I hope, instead, to have created an interesting character.</p>
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		<title>By: Marie Brennan</title>
		<link>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6338</link>
		<author>Marie Brennan</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Apr 2009 20:49:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6338</guid>
		<description>Hi Steve,

I hear you, but I stand by my original point.  Number of capillaries isn't likely to affect characterization, and I have yet to hear of a behavioral difference that isn't complicated by a bunch of exceptions and caveats, to the point where I'm dubious of the value of using it as a starting point.  If you approach it as a matter of "here's the average, and here's how my character deviates from it," that strikes me as likely to produce the kind of characterization that bothers me: female characters treated *as* deviations from the norm.  "Oh, she's tough and aggressive &lt;i&gt;for a woman&lt;/i&gt;," or (to flip it around) "he's awfully caring and nice, &lt;i&gt;for a man&lt;/i&gt;," or something else in that vein.

I honestly believe that writers who start off by thinking about how the character was raised, and in what kind of society, will generally get better results than the ones who start with a notion of biological absolutes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Steve,</p>
<p>I hear you, but I stand by my original point.  Number of capillaries isn&#8217;t likely to affect characterization, and I have yet to hear of a behavioral difference that isn&#8217;t complicated by a bunch of exceptions and caveats, to the point where I&#8217;m dubious of the value of using it as a starting point.  If you approach it as a matter of &#8220;here&#8217;s the average, and here&#8217;s how my character deviates from it,&#8221; that strikes me as likely to produce the kind of characterization that bothers me: female characters treated *as* deviations from the norm.  &#8220;Oh, she&#8217;s tough and aggressive <i>for a woman</i>,&#8221; or (to flip it around) &#8220;he&#8217;s awfully caring and nice, <i>for a man</i>,&#8221; or something else in that vein.</p>
<p>I honestly believe that writers who start off by thinking about how the character was raised, and in what kind of society, will generally get better results than the ones who start with a notion of biological absolutes.</p>
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		<title>By: Gerald Brandt &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Weekly Links 20090426</title>
		<link>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6319</link>
		<author>Gerald Brandt &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Weekly Links 20090426</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Apr 2009 01:32:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6319</guid>
		<description>[...] - Marie Brennan talks about how she writes female characters. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] - Marie Brennan talks about how she writes female characters. [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: Steven Egan</title>
		<link>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6302</link>
		<author>Steven Egan</author>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Apr 2009 23:49:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.sfnovelists.com/2009/04/16/how-i-write-female-characters/#comment-6302</guid>
		<description>I'm a guy who has trouble writing girls, so this was great (and encouraging!) to read. I would like to say though that to treat all differences between men and women as cultural is entirely and exactly wrong. There are numerous biological differences between men and women beyond sex organs, musculature and facial hair. A quick google search will reveal that the differences are as large as the functioning of our brains and as small as the number of capillaries in our fingers and toes. Naturally an exactly average person exists only in theory, but its important to understand this theory so that you can understand the ways in which your own characters deviate from it.

In other words, biology precedes and supersedes culture.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a guy who has trouble writing girls, so this was great (and encouraging!) to read. I would like to say though that to treat all differences between men and women as cultural is entirely and exactly wrong. There are numerous biological differences between men and women beyond sex organs, musculature and facial hair. A quick google search will reveal that the differences are as large as the functioning of our brains and as small as the number of capillaries in our fingers and toes. Naturally an exactly average person exists only in theory, but its important to understand this theory so that you can understand the ways in which your own characters deviate from it.</p>
<p>In other words, biology precedes and supersedes culture.</p>
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