Comments on: In Praise of Formula Writing http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/ A mutual support group for SF/F Novelists Thu, 09 Feb 2012 21:39:12 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Sean http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-9840 Sean Mon, 18 Oct 2010 04:11:05 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-9840 Glad I found this. I'm in the middle of rewrites for my first novel, and I realised I was following a formula that's uncannily similar to my second novel. I started freaking, but then I googled this and found out I'm alright. The formula's not a problem. It's the writing and the subject matter. Whether the subject matter is engaging or not is up to my future readers, but I feel confident enough to say that it'll be up to snuff for most. Thanks for this! Glad I found this. I’m in the middle of rewrites for my first novel, and I realised I was following a formula that’s uncannily similar to my second novel. I started freaking, but then I googled this and found out I’m alright. The formula’s not a problem. It’s the writing and the subject matter. Whether the subject matter is engaging or not is up to my future readers, but I feel confident enough to say that it’ll be up to snuff for most.

Thanks for this!

]]> By: Thomas http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1552 Thomas Wed, 09 Jan 2008 01:13:26 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1552 Howdy, Personally, I don't think it is possible to write a story or tell it without there being some formula in it. I'm not just talking about your average hum-drum Hollywood assembly line of movies. I think every story has elements of formula, and those that don't, that deliberately strives not to, are relegated to the terminally abstract, esoteric minded, which account for perhaps one percent of one percent of society. This is why in literary studies you always run up against canons, theme devices, plot devices, symbolism, etc. This are the markers that lets the reader in on what happened, what is happening, and what might happen. That is how Aristotle derived his famous six elements of a tragedy. You can only come up with these six elements if there are commonalities to all these kinds of stories. I was told once that humanity is in what we all hold in common, not what divides us. This is so with stories. A good story will have many elements that are similar to other stories, and because of that, some degree of formula is inescapable. (Even Shakespeare did not invent Macbeth in a vacuum.) Howdy,

Personally, I don’t think it is possible to write a story or tell it without there being some formula in it. I’m not just talking about your average hum-drum Hollywood assembly line of movies. I think every story has elements of formula, and those that don’t, that deliberately strives not to, are relegated to the terminally abstract, esoteric minded, which account for perhaps one percent of one percent of society.

This is why in literary studies you always run up against canons, theme devices, plot devices, symbolism, etc. This are the markers that lets the reader in on what happened, what is happening, and what might happen. That is how Aristotle derived his famous six elements of a tragedy. You can only come up with these six elements if there are commonalities to all these kinds of stories.

I was told once that humanity is in what we all hold in common, not what divides us. This is so with stories. A good story will have many elements that are similar to other stories, and because of that, some degree of formula is inescapable. (Even Shakespeare did not invent Macbeth in a vacuum.)

]]> By: Daemon http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1497 Daemon Fri, 04 Jan 2008 22:33:56 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1497 I'm ambivalent about the use formulaic plots and genre conventions. They don't bother me when they are used well, but can be annoying if used a bit too obviously. Honestly, though, I think many of the people who complain about a genre's "formulas" are basicly complaining about the genre itself. You know, people who just don't like magic or space ships, or stories about people falling in love. It's just a way to dismiss the stories they were already going to dismiss, but do it in way that lets them feel justified. A lot of people who take issue with formula in genre fiction are perfectly content to accept it in other fields - such as their TV preferances. I’m ambivalent about the use formulaic plots and genre conventions. They don’t bother me when they are used well, but can be annoying if used a bit too obviously.

Honestly, though, I think many of the people who complain about a genre’s “formulas” are basicly complaining about the genre itself. You know, people who just don’t like magic or space ships, or stories about people falling in love. It’s just a way to dismiss the stories they were already going to dismiss, but do it in way that lets them feel justified.

A lot of people who take issue with formula in genre fiction are perfectly content to accept it in other fields – such as their TV preferances.

]]> By: Mister Nice Guy http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1456 Mister Nice Guy Wed, 02 Jan 2008 07:09:40 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1456 Recently, my life has taken a depressing turn -- after years of mere irritation and anxiety. I find that I have a powerful need for formulaic writing and a lack of anything challenging or disturbing in what I read just now. Maybe I should reconsider selling my 1960s comic books.... Recently, my life has taken a depressing turn — after years of mere irritation and anxiety.

I find that I have a powerful need for formulaic writing and a lack of anything challenging or disturbing in what I read just now.

Maybe I should reconsider selling my 1960s comic books….

]]> By: S.C. Butler http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1450 S.C. Butler Tue, 01 Jan 2008 18:32:25 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1450 I've used the sonnet analogy as well, especially in explaining some of the tropes in fantasy to people who don't necessarily believe in fantasy, but do believe in sonnets. I’ve used the sonnet analogy as well, especially in explaining some of the tropes in fantasy to people who don’t necessarily believe in fantasy, but do believe in sonnets.

]]> By: Kip W http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1446 Kip W Tue, 01 Jan 2008 14:38:22 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1446 Lester Dent, who wrote the majority of the Doc Savage books, used a <a href="http://www.miskatonic.org/dent.html" rel="nofollow">formula </a>. Introduce the hero, swat him with a fistful of trouble, hint at a mystery... toss in a surprise about once per page of manuscript... and so on. The formula works if you're as good as Dent. If you can't write, you can take the formula and still turn out bad work. Perhaps diligent use of the thing will at least give some structure to what you produce, though. Lester Dent, who wrote the majority of the Doc Savage books, used a formula . Introduce the hero, swat him with a fistful of trouble, hint at a mystery… toss in a surprise about once per page of manuscript… and so on.

The formula works if you’re as good as Dent. If you can’t write, you can take the formula and still turn out bad work. Perhaps diligent use of the thing will at least give some structure to what you produce, though.

]]> By: Mike Brotherton http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1430 Mike Brotherton Mon, 31 Dec 2007 23:00:27 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1430 I don't know if it's entirely formula, although perhaps in Mason's case, and the case for young readers, it is. I think it's more a matter of just satisfying expectations. A mystery is presented, it had better be resolved. And that governs everything from what's behind the door being opened in the first paragraph of a story to the fate of the world in an alien invasion. Every time a question pops up, whether it is a question involving plot, character, or setting, it must be satisfied by the end of the story or there's no satisfaction. A reader expects a resolution, and will wait for it happily (if not impatiently) once the mystery is presented. At its most basic, I think a "formula" is just a successful balancing act that creates the most satisfying wait between the presentation of a question/problem and it's solution. As an aside, and probably to my detriment as a writer, I've always admired stories and novels that seem more like real life and don't always answer all the mysteries, somehow managing to avoid doing so without being totally unsatisfying. I don’t know if it’s entirely formula, although perhaps in Mason’s case, and the case for young readers, it is. I think it’s more a matter of just satisfying expectations. A mystery is presented, it had better be resolved. And that governs everything from what’s behind the door being opened in the first paragraph of a story to the fate of the world in an alien invasion. Every time a question pops up, whether it is a question involving plot, character, or setting, it must be satisfied by the end of the story or there’s no satisfaction. A reader expects a resolution, and will wait for it happily (if not impatiently) once the mystery is presented. At its most basic, I think a “formula” is just a successful balancing act that creates the most satisfying wait between the presentation of a question/problem and it’s solution.

As an aside, and probably to my detriment as a writer, I’ve always admired stories and novels that seem more like real life and don’t always answer all the mysteries, somehow managing to avoid doing so without being totally unsatisfying.

]]> By: Lynne Thomas http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1429 Lynne Thomas Mon, 31 Dec 2007 21:59:09 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1429 I've often used the concept of the sonnet as a way of explaining the need for formula. Formula needs to exist to provide structure, but the real genius comes with what you *do* with that structure. All sonnets are the same, the same way that all romance novels are the same. But there are big differences between Shakespeare and Spenser, even when they write in the same genre. I’ve often used the concept of the sonnet as a way of explaining the need for formula. Formula needs to exist to provide structure, but the real genius comes with what you *do* with that structure. All sonnets are the same, the same way that all romance novels are the same. But there are big differences between Shakespeare and Spenser, even when they write in the same genre.

]]> By: The Eeyore Librarian http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1428 The Eeyore Librarian Mon, 31 Dec 2007 18:28:44 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/31/in-praise-of-formula-writing/#comment-1428 I totally agree, especially for emergent/reluctant readers. Or for those of us who need a brain break and reach for the nearest bodice ripper!! I'd like to pretend every reading choice is one that will challenge or engage me, but sometimes you just want a good yarn. I totally agree, especially for emergent/reluctant readers. Or for those of us who need a brain break and reach for the nearest bodice ripper!! I’d like to pretend every reading choice is one that will challenge or engage me, but sometimes you just want a good yarn.

]]>