Comments on: Dark Nights of Despair http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/ A mutual support group for SF/F Novelists Thu, 20 Nov 2008 17:42:57 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.1 By: Daryl Gregory http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1411 Daryl Gregory Sat, 29 Dec 2007 04:32:05 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1411 I'm writing book 2 in a 2-book contract in which the second book has nothing to do with the first, and I'm not having a dark night of the soul so much as a dark year. The problem is, I keep comparing the current book to its more handsome, dashing, and already-editor-approved brother. Book 2 is darker in tone, the protagonist less likeable, the plot less linear, the scope more personal and less sweeping... etc. You see my problem: Too much of my thinking is about what the book is not, or about how it's different from the other one, rather than what the book IS. This is not productive, but it's very hard to shake. But years ago I'd read Delany's advice by way of Tom Disch, and I've repeatedly done the exercise that you're talking about, Greg. It's reaped some benefits in a more complex plot and more nuanced characters, but it's been most helpful in helping me fall in love with the current book, rather than pining for the golden days of book 1. Then a part of me thinks, were you really that confident while writing book 1, Daryl, or are you now just remembering that way? I have a sneaking suspicion when I'm writing my next book I'll look back on book 2 and think, Why isn't this working as easily as that one? Anyway, thanks for writing about this. --d I’m writing book 2 in a 2-book contract in which the second book has nothing to do with the first, and I’m not having a dark night of the soul so much as a dark year. The problem is, I keep comparing the current book to its more handsome, dashing, and already-editor-approved brother. Book 2 is darker in tone, the protagonist less likeable, the plot less linear, the scope more personal and less sweeping… etc. You see my problem: Too much of my thinking is about what the book is not, or about how it’s different from the other one, rather than what the book IS. This is not productive, but it’s very hard to shake.

But years ago I’d read Delany’s advice by way of Tom Disch, and I’ve repeatedly done the exercise that you’re talking about, Greg. It’s reaped some benefits in a more complex plot and more nuanced characters, but it’s been most helpful in helping me fall in love with the current book, rather than pining for the golden days of book 1. Then a part of me thinks, were you really that confident while writing book 1, Daryl, or are you now just remembering that way? I have a sneaking suspicion when I’m writing my next book I’ll look back on book 2 and think, Why isn’t this working as easily as that one?

Anyway, thanks for writing about this.

–d

]]> By: Mike Brotherton http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1376 Mike Brotherton Thu, 27 Dec 2007 20:02:36 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1376 "Lately my dark night of despair has come in the midst of revisions." Yeah, that's where it hits me, too, usually. It's probably because I hate revisions and that's the place where that editorial spotlight is shining the brightest, because it now all really has to be right. Polished. Done. And there are these threads that are frayed, scenes where the characters don't feel quite right, or the setting is a white room and I can't remember what it really was supposed to be. It's probably because I also write from a detailed plot outline, and even though I spend a fair amount of time on that, there are things you discover about your characters and world during the writing of the first draft that clash with the original vision. I find myself looking around, trying to figure out how to piece it together, and wondering. And then I get drunk and work and it all makes sense. I mean, I just work through it, eventually, or I wouldn't be published. Everyone who has some measure of success finds a way through it. And it seems to happen to most of us, indeed. “Lately my dark night of despair has come in the midst of revisions.”

Yeah, that’s where it hits me, too, usually. It’s probably because I hate revisions and that’s the place where that editorial spotlight is shining the brightest, because it now all really has to be right. Polished. Done. And there are these threads that are frayed, scenes where the characters don’t feel quite right, or the setting is a white room and I can’t remember what it really was supposed to be.

It’s probably because I also write from a detailed plot outline, and even though I spend a fair amount of time on that, there are things you discover about your characters and world during the writing of the first draft that clash with the original vision. I find myself looking around, trying to figure out how to piece it together, and wondering.

And then I get drunk and work and it all makes sense. I mean, I just work through it, eventually, or I wouldn’t be published. Everyone who has some measure of success finds a way through it. And it seems to happen to most of us, indeed.

]]> By: Gregory Frost http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1353 Gregory Frost Mon, 24 Dec 2007 19:12:04 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1353 Yeah, That's about how it works for me. When doing the laundry starts to look inviting, I know I'm in trouble. And coming out of it really is a kind of "faint zephyr of synchronicity"--that's a great phrase. gf Yeah,
That’s about how it works for me. When doing the laundry starts to look inviting, I know I’m in trouble. And coming out of it really is a kind of “faint zephyr of synchronicity”–that’s a great phrase.

gf

]]> By: Stephen Leigh http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1346 Stephen Leigh Mon, 24 Dec 2007 13:43:43 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1346 Hope the genre-shift to mystery goes well for you! I love Maureen's chart and have used it in the novel-writing class I teach. I know that dark night of despair well -- usually right around the middle of every novel when I find myself becalmed in a Sargasso Sea of Writing, and I start to think that I'm a sham and I've lost whatever creativity I had and that I'll never find my way out of this mess. I'll start rcleaning the office or doing some of the necessary chores that have accuulated around the house and reading anything non-fictional that has some tenuous link to the novel... so far, every time, there comes this eventual faint zephyr of synchronicity, and I'll find myself moving forward again. But I'd sure love to skip that step in the process! Hope the genre-shift to mystery goes well for you!

I love Maureen’s chart and have used it in the novel-writing class I teach. I know that dark night of despair well — usually right around the middle of every novel when I find myself becalmed in a Sargasso Sea of Writing, and I start to think that I’m a sham and I’ve lost whatever creativity I had and that I’ll never find my way out of this mess. I’ll start rcleaning the office or doing some of the necessary chores that have accuulated around the house and reading anything non-fictional that has some tenuous link to the novel… so far, every time, there comes this eventual faint zephyr of synchronicity, and I’ll find myself moving forward again.

But I’d sure love to skip that step in the process!

]]> By: jere7my http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1341 jere7my Mon, 24 Dec 2007 06:55:52 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1341 S.C. Butler: In my experience, yes indeed, it does work multiple times per book, 'cos each scene brings new motivations and layers to revive your flagging interest. If I'm banging my head against a scene, digging down to find something I hadn't thought of, something that adds a new shape or movement to the scene, is almost always part of the solution that (eventually) breaks me through the wall. S.C. Butler:

In my experience, yes indeed, it does work multiple times per book, ‘cos each scene brings new motivations and layers to revive your flagging interest. If I’m banging my head against a scene, digging down to find something I hadn’t thought of, something that adds a new shape or movement to the scene, is almost always part of the solution that (eventually) breaks me through the wall.

]]> By: Diana Pharaoh Francis http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1338 Diana Pharaoh Francis Mon, 24 Dec 2007 05:48:26 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1338 Lately my dark night of despair has come in the midst of revisions. Where it's so hard to know if the pieces fit together really. The other day, we drove up on the Snake River Gorge near Twin Falls. From less than a mile away, there was no way to tell the Gorge was there. The ground looked absolutely flat and solid. But then all of a sudden, we come up on it and there's is this gaping trench in the earth that goes on for miles. That's what I worry about in my novel. What if, when I look over the landscape, am I missing a big gaping fracture? Does it look of a piece but with dreadful, hidden flaws? I just can't tell right now. My head isn't able. But hopefully a break will let me. Di Lately my dark night of despair has come in the midst of revisions. Where it’s so hard to know if the pieces fit together really. The other day, we drove up on the Snake River Gorge near Twin Falls. From less than a mile away, there was no way to tell the Gorge was there. The ground looked absolutely flat and solid. But then all of a sudden, we come up on it and there’s is this gaping trench in the earth that goes on for miles. That’s what I worry about in my novel. What if, when I look over the landscape, am I missing a big gaping fracture? Does it look of a piece but with dreadful, hidden flaws?

I just can’t tell right now. My head isn’t able. But hopefully a break will let me.

Di

]]> By: S.C. Butler http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1335 S.C. Butler Mon, 24 Dec 2007 04:39:28 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1335 Hmm. I might have to try this technique. The question is, does it work more than once per book? Generally I encounter dark nights of despair about a third of the way into a book, and quite frequently thereafter. Hmm. I might have to try this technique. The question is, does it work more than once per book? Generally I encounter dark nights of despair about a third of the way into a book, and quite frequently thereafter.

]]> By: Chris R http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1331 Chris R Sun, 23 Dec 2007 20:19:39 +0000 http://www.sfnovelists.com/2007/12/23/dark-nights-of-despair/#comment-1331 Have you thought about using a different name like James Clemens/Rollins does? Have you thought about using a different name like James Clemens/Rollins does?

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